Curse

A Kantara · Oct 24, 2006, 11:46 PM // 23:46

This was a build i made as i dident have a ranger at the time and was getting tierd of normal necro roles and found that it works realy well

Profession N/R
Name Necro Barrager
Type PvE
Category Support Barrager for Tomb of the Primeval Kings B/P Teams
Attributes
Soul Reaping 4 +1 (base+minor rune)
Curses 7 +1 +3 (base+hat+superior rune)
Beast Mastery 7
Wilderness Survival 8
Marksmanship 12

Skills Set
Barrage {Elite, Marksmanship}
Tiger's Fury
Suffering
Mark of Pain
Troll Unguent
Comfort Animal
Charm Animal
Resurrection Signet

Summary
The purpose of this build is to deal damage through the use of Suffering and Tiger's Fury with a Vampirc short Bow as well as a more balenced attributes set due to Soul Reaping's energy recovery. For a Ranger to mantain Tiger's Fury while using Barrage with a short bow they need 12 points on Experties how ever in places like Tomb of the Primeval Kings the constent death of things around the Barrager allows for only 5 points on Soul Reaping with out accuring any energy problems while spaming both Tiger's Fury + Barrage as well as Suffering. Suffering is a blanket hex that covers both the target and all nearby foes with a -2 health degen when combined with a 19-20% damage vs Hexed foes helps counter the lower damage done dwe to only 12 on Marksmanship. However Mark of pain is the real damage dealer with 11 on Curses it deals 32 damage to adjacent foes as well as triggering the AI's AoE scater. Now you asking how can scater be a good thing to a barrage team well mostly it cant however with a good MM and a good Pull the foes are traped in narrow points of the map casting Mark of Pain and triggering the scater causes traped foes to stop atacking the minions yet have no were to run to as the minions + pets block them running at you while the rest of the foes block them excaping while they are reciving constant damage. when using Mark of pain in less narrow points be sure to not cast it on the nearst targer but rather two or 3 back this way the damage causes less scater as Mark of pain only causes scater when the target is hit by multipule arrows at once it is also a good idear to switch to a recurve (which slows your rate of fire) to limit scater. In open arears Mark of pain is wasted as the foes seldem stay in tight packs. The best is to use Mark of Pain when the conditions are right rather than just spaming it. When used right in a barrager team Mark of pain + Barrage can do 400 or more damage per shot {the maths behind that claim 32(Mark Of Pain) X 9(adjacent foes) + 30 X 6(30 damage is a bad hit from barrage) = 408 damage leaving out the damage delt by suffering.

Notes & Concerns
Necro Armor is normal 60 or 70. i usaly use scar patern which only has 60 armor all though this has not caused real problems evan when using a short bow and being close to the aggro.
Resurrection Signet is a problem as there is nothing to recharge it. How ever the necro barager build is designed to be front to middle lines of the team all though i have some times sacrefised my self to alow the monk or a R/Mo to excape from a colapsing team
Mark of pain scater should caus a problem but i have all ways been selective on my casting and i have never has it backfire evan it the orignal test build that requierd spaming it. All ways best to tab twice to move from the frount target when casting it.
Troll Unguent can be replaced with Dust trap, Winnowing or Apply poison depending on the player and the teams needs. I mostly use Winnowing as most ranger builds suffer by to adding.

AuraofMana · Oct 25, 2006, 02:33 AM // 02:33

Spellcheck please...
True Barrager > All =/
Expertise > SR in a B/P build.
Barrager is meant to kill, if you want to play supporting damage... go play an Order nec. If you want to play curse go play SS. SS deals way more damage than mark of pain and suffering. Even a Blood Spiker deals more damage than this build >>

Blackhawk · Oct 25, 2006, 05:41 AM // 05:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by AuraofMana

Even a Blood Spiker deals more damage than this build >>

Mickey Mouse would deal more damage than that build, its crap so leave Barrage to a Ranger please and stick to something a Necros supposed to do.

*Waits for the bet an ecto it works better than a Barrager response* like I saw you doing in Tombs recently.

Rancour · Oct 25, 2006, 02:30 PM // 14:30

I won't bash the build, but I must ask: What's the point? What can YOU do that a normal Barrager can't? Why would one choose this build over a normal Barrager?

Emik · Oct 25, 2006, 05:50 PM // 17:50

Makes me wonder the same thing.
First off a good Barrager has 4 ranks more on MMS which can potentially deal +24 damage divided over targets.
Add a longer duration of Tigers Fury: with BM at 9 that lasts 9 secs.
And that's without any spirits up.
That means you can dish out +120 damage across a group of 6 enemies if you're using a Flat or Shortbow
Add FW and WW to the pot and it's ownage
Expertise is still at 9 so that lowers the cost for Barrage to 2 with a potential 6 energy regain should that bow be a zealous one.
Turbo Barrage FTW

Pick Me · Oct 25, 2006, 06:31 PM // 18:31

I would make some minor changes to your build.

Barrage (e)
Mark of Pain
Barbs
Weaken Armor
Tiger's Fury
Favorable Winds
Troll Ungent
Rez Signet

As you can see, the pet is useless, so I dropped it. No skills, less than 12 in BM, makes no sense to have it.

This will give you more damage to 1 target and with MoP, you do more damage to adjacent targets (of the one that you hexed).

Hope this helps.

Blackhawk · Oct 25, 2006, 06:31 PM // 18:31

I use Lightning Reflexes rather than Tigers Fury these days on my Barrager since they nerfed it down to 25% from 33%, so thats another reason why a Ranger will attack harder and faster and longer compared to a Necro with 12 in Marks as a weak barrage is pretty useless in Tombs (or anywhere else come to think of it), and you shouldnt really pump up BM to 9 for Tombs anyway as the pets supposed to die for the MM

Not worth taking FW at 12 in Marks Pick Me, seeing as I've seen this guy in Tombs bragging how wonderful his build is compared to a proper Barrage build, pet would be more useful.

AuraofMana · Oct 26, 2006, 01:37 AM // 01:37

The time you used to cast those curses a true Barrager will deal more damage than you even the Barrager somehow only have 12 Marksmanship.
Don't go around and brag on builds, this build is like the acme of random pointless builds that make no sense at all.
No Rebirth = crap.

A Kantara · Oct 26, 2006, 11:30 AM // 11:30

The point of this build is to barrage as a Necro as at the time i dident have a ranger and it is fun to barrage. It in no way replaces a ranger in total damage. The damage delt is to play catch up to a Ranger with full 16 on marks(which many dont seem to have). How ever tombs is not hard using the B/p team build you dont actualy need any rangers and with good players using just A/R Mo/R and E/R can clear tombs with out taking a single death with hardly any more time or effort than it would take a good team of R/Mo to do the same.
In the end GW is a game i play to have fun i dont farm tombs for the greens and odd ecto heck i sell most of the greens as junk and gamble the ectos away. I play the game to have fun

.

I by no means ment to brag about this build, it is hardly worth it. I just feel that the Alternat builds deserve some web space. So if any one was thinking of how they would go N/R barager here is how i have tryed

ps A normal Ranger will do more damage! :P

Sir Mad · Oct 26, 2006, 06:57 PM // 18:57

Erm I really doubt you have enough energy for that. Tiger's Furry builds generally have 13 expertise to reduce the cost of barrage to 2 energy (and the cost of TF itself). With your build, you're going to spend 10 energy point for TF every 12 secs (note: you can't have it active all the time with your level in BM) and 5 more points every 1.5 seconds for barrage when TF is active. And you still enough energy for mark of pain and suffering. I haven't tested it, but for being used to play a barrager, I can guess you'll be dry quickly.

Gorebrex · Nov 02, 2006, 02:51 AM // 02:51

/makes note not to post my experimental N/R builds
Seeing as how the dont do somewhere rather close to the maximum damage possible, even though theyd be for PvE only.

I dont get that, but whatever. I really like the N/R, hadnt tried it before today, works very well with henchie team(full team, btw). Not for farming, or PvP, just to do good(imo) damage to mobs.
Will post pic a little later.

camulus · Nov 06, 2006, 08:27 PM // 20:27

No matter what you do in this game there are always people who will knock your build or whatever.

Ive done tombs enough to gather over 200 ectos, using two rangers, monk , mm , orders, nec/ranger, ele/ranger and after all that I need to support you.

Both rangers I converted to ranger necro purely because of the sheer damage they can do with MOP and BARBS.
16marks'
0 expertise
9 beast
11 curses
barrage, distract,rez (sometimes...often dont take it, there are enough ranger/monks in groups with rebirth after all thats only reason they are R/M)
MOP, BARBS Charm, comfort.

Discussion
Standard barrage damage PLUS

Ranger/Necro 11 curses
32 damage on all adjacent when mark is hit by minions or foe.
Single shot on mark = 32 damage to all surrounding
Damage formula
5 foes (32 damagex5 =160 damage per hit on mark)
5 rangers+5 minions+3 pets (some will be dead) = possible 13 hits on mark = 13x160 = 2100 damage
Personal experience trying to count damage
Often estimate damage around 600 - 900 over 5 secs (counting damage on screen really fast.
Note: This damage is on top of damage from barrage

Necro Ranger 16 curses
5 foes (42 damagex5 =210 damage per hit on mark)
5 rangers+5 minions+3 pets (some will be dead) = possible 13 hits on mark = 13x210 = 2730 damage
Personal experience trying to count damage
Often estimate damage around 900 - 1500 over 5 secs (counting damage on screen really fast.
Note: This damage is on top of damage from barrage. My personal barrage damage is less because of lower marks.

Conclusion
Over many many runs, taking in to account lack of expertise and standard barrage reload time due to lack of expertise, damage done, times when skills down from pet dead, interrupts
I have no doubt the N/R inflicts more damage than my R/N. Unfortunately it is just a pain to get in to groups or form them due to people with conflicting views or who just use cookie cutter builds.

Either way the extra damage from MOP outweighs damage done by any single ranger.

Similar effects occur with barbs

MOP is so effective I now use it on my orders, mm and monk. More damage means less need to heal.

Bear in mind in choke points such as stairs on last level, and large mobs the damage is far greater, and the most I have ever been able to estimate based on a screen full of damage points is about 2000 in 3 secs on the stairs in last level.

I strongly suggest people try it,,, and if you want to flame it plse state if you tried it or not. Because until you do, you are not really qualified to knock it. Personally I think if you try it you will be amazed at the damage. Try marking a target further back in the mob so they live longer

P.S. MOP is so good all my heroes have it and using henchies I am halfway thorugh Nightfall using same tombs build. I also prefer the damage to SS because it lasts longer, is cheaper and reloads faster.

Good Luck with game

camulus · Nov 06, 2006, 09:22 PM // 21:22

There are so many conflicting views on how tombs should be done with ranger barrage groups,, all I can say from experience leading numerous runs or being in groups using monk, orders, mm, ranger is:

The most successful FAST groups are those that rez pets constantly and forever keep up a wall between them and the enemy.

When pets are left dead there is lots more chance the group will have to retreat and or get overrun and killed.

There is lots and lots and lots of room for flexibility , for skill loading and Ranger Monks are not not necessarily the best build. Its a waste of unused skills to have slots with a skill you dont use that could be used for other damage. Two in a group is all that is needed with the purpose that if need be they need to back off to rebirth. (shouldnt happen on a good group , really only the puller should be at risk of dying)

Other primary professions with ranger pet basics (barrage/distract,charm/comfort) can be very very effective in a group.

Pets are not just minion food and provide three purposes for being in the group, anyone know what those are??????

I firmly believe ppl should be more openminded on the build, I fully believe in ranger pet basic concept as being the fastest way to do tombs but too many ppl just get locked on one way of doing it ,,,,,, there are always better ways.

LightningHell · Nov 07, 2006, 08:41 AM // 08:41

One thing, from first glance (and ignoring the 12-rank cap due to no runes)...why do you have a Pet in there?

NJudson · Nov 08, 2006, 12:17 AM // 00:17

I do find this build interesting and could be fun to try. This build may not be the most efficient or do more damage compared to standard bp ranger builds, but give the guy some credit. Personally, I'm not against partying up with others that have non-standard tombs builds....it makes it interesting and its a nice break from the ordinary. Hell, I didn't even care when some guy brought his R/N and used Life Transfer instead of Barrage. We still made it through ok.

Heck, its been a while since I played Tombs, but last time I went the monk (Mo/Rt) used mending + recuperation and amazingly it worked great. I've always heard that you shouldn't use enchantments in tombs, but it was one of the best tombs runs I ever been on. I had +4 mending on me, +3 recuperation, vigorous spirt (+10) and a vamp bow for a good part of that tombs run. It was awesome.

So moral of the story...just because you like a specific build and it works for you, try not to be so quick to knock everyone elses builds. Constructive criticism...sure, trashing...bah.

camulus · Feb 27, 2007, 12:19 AM // 00:19

For anyone interested here is a link to a picture of a single cast of ranger necro and MOP in tombs. Bear in mind its hard to capture the damage as fast as it happens other than in video which I dont know how to do , so there is probably another 300 or so at least damage not accounted for.

Also it wasnt a very good cast because they were already spread out.

Here is a link of a reasonable orders cast of MOP, again , bear in mind not all damage was captured.

Oh,,,,,,,,,,you just cant help laughing to yourself when you get a really good cast that is screen wide and three rows deep full of damage, and it appears two or three times in about 10 secs.

By the way , tweaking builds all the time and now dropped HP and using 8 or 9 expertise, whatever breakpoint was, cant remember, still using 11 points on all non necro primaries.

Cathode_Reborn · Feb 27, 2007, 02:37 AM // 02:37

This build is better off being used on an R/N.

Don't forget that higher marksman = better chance of getting crit hits, which can make a big different.

sph0nz · Feb 27, 2007, 02:48 AM // 02:48

gg.

Glints Bane · Feb 27, 2007, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Ok well this isn't directly about your build, but as I have learned here in the guildwarsguru.com necro section never post anything that has a necro holding anything other then a staff or wand/offhand because you WILL be flamed for it. Doesn't matter if the build is good or not, you will be flamed. don't worry I used to think places like this would be helpful but I learned quick its filled with those "your a noob get off guild wars" kind of people and not "you know you could change this one thing" kind of people. Sorry I had to say this,but I am tired of people flaming others who are trying to make a build that is out of the box for a certian proffesion, even if it doesn't work in some places. If I posted all the builds I come up with for my necro I would be on fire faster then MT Saint Helen, but alot of my builds work(some don't but not everything will work) and I can farm alot of places because I stopped listening to the negative Speach that comes from this section. Sorry for the rant but I'm just tired of the BS.

Cathode_Reborn · Feb 27, 2007, 08:05 AM // 08:05

[skill]Discord[/skill][skill]Mark of Fury[/skill][skill]Barbed Spear[/skill][skill]Merciless Spear[/skill][skill]Disrupting Throw[/skill]

I was usin that a few times, it's somewhat effective and fun =p You can put in Ulcerous Lungs to stack some more degen. Discord + Deep wound = ouch.

...For some strange reason, I didn't think about using Apply Poison for the condition untill now....